Break Bleeders

Post Reply
User avatar
FRUNKenstein
Curator Extraordinaire
Posts: 3938
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 11:02 pm
Location: Wheat field, dammit, wheat!
Contact:

Break Bleeders

Post by FRUNKenstein » Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:45 pm

So, Sunday, I spent an hour and a half screwing up a break bleed job on my 996tt. First, I broke off the outer bleed screw on the right front caliber. But, since I didn't get the screw to turn, it remains drivable. So, after bleeding the other 7 bleed screws, I went for a short drive. Pedal was mushy, mushy, mushy.

Here is the Harbor Freight vacuum break bleeder I used:

https://www.harborfreight.com/brake-flu ... 92924.html

Brake bleeder 2.jpg
Brake bleeder 2.jpg (122.87 KiB) Viewed 2306 times
Brake bleeder.jpg
Brake bleeder.jpg (80.84 KiB) Viewed 2306 times

The instructions say the vacuum bleeder operates at 90 to 120 psi. My 8 gallon, 2 hp compressor, 125 psi max electric compressor just couldn't hold 90+ psi for more than about 15 seconds at a time. So, I constantly had to release the vacuum trigger, wait for 20 seconds or so and then re-engage. I think that led to air getting into the brake lines. I was careful to keep the brake fluid reservoir topped off the entire time, so I am confident that air didn't get in from the top of the system. I'm taking the car into the shop tomorrow to have the broken bleeder screw replaced and the brakes competently bled.

My question for the crowd is what is the easiest and most effective break bleeding method/system/equipment? Since the hooptie fleet is up to 6 cars, plus 3 daily drivers, it makes sense to invest a little money into a break bleeder. A pressure bleeder that pushes from the top? A higher quality vacuum bleeder coupled with a bigger compressor? Just save the tool money and always take it to a professional?

I like doing break jobs since the mechanics like to charge an arm and a leg for something that is relatively simple. So, I'd like to become competent at bleeding/flushing the brake system. My retired professional mechanic uncle always says that 90% of any job is having the right tools. What say you?
www.kansascityautomuseum.com
Current:
2002 996TT X50, Guards Red
1987 928S4, Guards Red
1987 951, Guards Red
1973 914 2.0 Bahia Red

2006 955S, Lapis Blue
Other toys:
1988 BMW 325i Cabriolet, Alpin Weiss
1987 Bertone X1/9, Verde Chiaro
Gone but not forgotten: 1975 914 2.0, Laguna Blue; 1999 996 C4 Aerokit Black; 1990 964 C2 Guards Red; 2006 955S Arctic Silver

User avatar
Einsteiger
Posts: 455
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2018 11:40 am
Location: Overland Park KS

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by Einsteiger » Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:01 pm

With the size of your fleet, [and since you have a proper lift] it just might make sense to up the ante for a better bleeder set up and a compressor that's up to the task. I'd be inclined to avoid Harbor Freight when you upgrade. :)

Practice the most on the vehicle that get's driven the least. :)
Kevin
1999 C2 - Vesuvio Gray Metallic
Eastern Kansas

User avatar
02TX996Cab
NG (Second 100 Outposters!)
Posts: 298
Joined: Fri May 18, 2018 8:09 pm
Location: North Central Texas

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by 02TX996Cab » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:41 pm

I use a Motive brake (yeah, I know, you used "break" intentionally) bleeder. It's a pump-up pressure bleeder. The instructions say to fill the Motive bleeder part-way with fluid, but I run it dry and simply top up the car's brake fluid reservoir after I bleed each corner. Easy peasy and clean up is a snap. Pro tip, if you can get some blue ATE fluid (still available in Europe) use it every other fluid change, it makes knowing when you've flushed each corner a breeze.

https://www.motiveproducts.com/collecti ... an-bleeder
Proud owner of a Flat6-powered 2002 996 Cab, 2016 GT4, 2019 Ford F-150 "Country Cadillac", and 2005 Ford Focus (not so hot hatch) daily driver. And a Wright ZTO 52" to keep several acres of grass-like substance neat and tidy!

theprf
NG (Second 100 Outposters!)
Posts: 343
Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:33 am
Location: Central Mass

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by theprf » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:31 am

I use the Motive bleeder as well, also without loading it with fluid. It's just acting as an air pressure supply. Be sure to keep the master topped off with fluid; if you forget you blow air through the lines and have a major task re-bleeding.
I have never had any luck with vacuum bleeders at the bleed screw.

User avatar
sweet victory
OG (First 100 Outposters!)
Posts: 616
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:55 pm

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by sweet victory » Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:40 am

Another voucher for the dry method Motive bleeder. I replaced all the hoses on mine so I have just a whip line coming off the bleeder with a quick disconnect, have a separate 8' line, and various master cylinder reservoir adapters. This set up allows me to pump the bleeder while on the ground. Trying to lean over a fender/bump and pump it is not ideal. For a pain free experience, invest in the master cylinder screw on adapters; the universal ones that clamp on are annoying and it will be annoying to constant get it on and off with the dry method. Assenmacher Specialty Tools (AST) makes high quality adapters for pretty much all makes and models. Their part number #TA18 fits pretty much everything European. Made in the USA and nice quality; screws on perfectly with no leaks. https://asttool.com/detail_page.php?fro ... nf=Porsche

You can see using the quick disconnects to change between adapters is handy if you end up with two or three adapters.

User avatar
5chn3ll
Six shots...or only five?
Posts: 4640
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 4:35 pm

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by 5chn3ll » Wed Apr 21, 2021 8:49 am

Why do you do this to me, you sick SOB?
FRUNKenstein wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:45 pm break
caliber

Understeer: You will hit the wall with the front end.
Oversteer: You will hit the wall with the rear end.
Horsepower: How hard you will hit the wall.
Torque: How far you will move the wall.

Gone hunting with Alec Baldwin and Dick Cheney. Back soon.

User avatar
FRUNKenstein
Curator Extraordinaire
Posts: 3938
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 11:02 pm
Location: Wheat field, dammit, wheat!
Contact:

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by FRUNKenstein » Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:22 pm

Thanks for all of the info, fellas. It looks like the general consensus is pressure bleeders to push from the top. Great idea to add an extension between the pump and the master cylinder. I see the Motive one, and I think ECS Tuning sells the Schwaben one, which Heidi and Franny recommend after using the Motive one in their video on the subject. So, I think I'll try one of those 2 models.

BTW, when I asked the same question of the group at Porsche Lunch today, the overwhelming response was "I dunno, I let Karl bleed my brakes." (Karl is our local indy) Gee, thanks guys.

And Schnelly, if it makes you feel any better, I probably had to re-type "breaks" 20 times and "caliber" at least once - good grammar habits are hard to break.

grammar-punctuation-memes-15-720x464.jpg
grammar-punctuation-memes-15-720x464.jpg (44.83 KiB) Viewed 2278 times
www.kansascityautomuseum.com
Current:
2002 996TT X50, Guards Red
1987 928S4, Guards Red
1987 951, Guards Red
1973 914 2.0 Bahia Red

2006 955S, Lapis Blue
Other toys:
1988 BMW 325i Cabriolet, Alpin Weiss
1987 Bertone X1/9, Verde Chiaro
Gone but not forgotten: 1975 914 2.0, Laguna Blue; 1999 996 C4 Aerokit Black; 1990 964 C2 Guards Red; 2006 955S Arctic Silver

User avatar
5chn3ll
Six shots...or only five?
Posts: 4640
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 4:35 pm

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by 5chn3ll » Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:24 pm

It wasn't subtle, mang.

Understeer: You will hit the wall with the front end.
Oversteer: You will hit the wall with the rear end.
Horsepower: How hard you will hit the wall.
Torque: How far you will move the wall.

Gone hunting with Alec Baldwin and Dick Cheney. Back soon.

JayG
OG (First 100 Outposters!)
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:22 am
Location: Austin (Lago Vista) and the Desert

Re: Break Bleeders

Post by JayG » Sun Dec 12, 2021 7:25 am

+996 on te motive power bleeder.
I also use it dry and put a disconnect in line so I can add more fluid to the master cylinder without having to repump completely

There are 2 versions, one with a plastic cap for the MC and one with metal. Get the metal one. Not too much more $$.
You can also get additional caps for other vehicles. The one for Porsche else work on most other German cars
2004 Boxster S 6 speed - DRL relay hack, Polaris AutoTop DIY (sold)
2004 996 Targa Tip
2020 BMW X3 Xdrive, 2004 F-150 "Big Red"

Post Reply