Flying Ducktail...

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Dr_Strangelove
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by Dr_Strangelove » Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:45 am

Wow, we're all gentlemen in the wheel thread but when it comes to aero...
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Kalashnikov
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by Kalashnikov » Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:30 pm

On the serious note, I think that riced up 996s and 986s will soon become a reality. Cars are cheap enough for HS kids to buy them, and modding will follow.

On the Mercedes forums the E55/E63/C63 cars started trickling down to ricer/mod crowd, and it is not pretty. Results of their "mods" usually end up in the classified section with titles like "Tastefully Modified", "Over $15,000 invested"; and for some reason all of their cars end up having some sort of critically debilitating fault resulting from modding or lack of funds for proper repairs. I told the guy who bought my E55 to leave it stock, and not try to modify it. Hopefully the repair bill print outs he got from me, gave him a strong reality check for what he can expect from his ownership experience. Some of the less lucky E55 owners had annual repair bills in excess of $5k year on the constant basis. W221 owners dipped north of $10k mark.

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SealGrauWailer
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by SealGrauWailer » Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:10 pm

Me no like the flying ducktail - looks good down, but up is wonky. The OEM aero is cool if you get the skirts & front pieces to go along with it. Some of the fixed ducktails are cool too, especially the ones that resemble the 997 sport classic aero. Anyhow, that's my take as a non-aero observer.
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5chn3ll
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by 5chn3ll » Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:44 am

The kid who pretty much pestered me until I agreed to sell my old supercharged project car got the same advice from me - it makes plenty of power, don't dick around with stuff until you know what you're doing, and for God's sake, don't lean it out.

So, of course, the kid went straight out and bought the biggest throttle body and supercharger pulley he could find but didn't bother with a tune...leaned it out...ventilated the block. I felt bad - he sold his car at a loss and took out a loan to buy my car and bricked it in less than a month - but I f****n toadaso.
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I've already seen a few tuner kiddie posts on other 996 forums...the dead giveaway is any thread title including the phrase "I/H/E questions..."
Kalashnikov wrote: Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:30 pmI told the guy who bought my E55 to leave it stock, and not try to modify it. Hopefully the repair bill print outs he got from me, gave him a strong reality check for what he can expect from his ownership experience. Some of the less lucky E55 owners had annual repair bills in excess of $5k year on the constant basis. W221 owners dipped north of $10k mark.

Understeer: You will hit the wall with the front end.
Oversteer: You will hit the wall with the rear end.
Horsepower: How hard you will hit the wall.
Torque: How far you will move the wall.

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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by EPiK » Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:58 am

Reading through this thread as ElSchnell noted.. hit me right in the feels..

I bought my very early 996.1 pretty modified by the POs.... 996 GT3 wheels, H&R sportsprings, replica of OEM aero front and skirts and GT3RS rep decklid and wing, K&N fipk intake and FabSpeed bypass tips. One thing I noticed right away is the need for a functional front lip to balance the downforce from the GT3RS rear. I totally get the reports of a light front end at 60+ mph.. kinda disconcerting when I want to head out and play on anything other than tight twisties, especially when the car accelerates and rocks back anyway.

I have a list and it goes like this..
-source front lip.. either aftermarket or OEM, or new front bumper. The current rep oem aero bumper is fiberglass so it is repairable though.. few curb grinds on the underside edges. also possibly diveplanes or canards on the front.
-properly attach sideskirts and seal in place.
-many other things..lol

alternatively, I may sell the GT3RS wing and decklid and install a true fiberglass ducktail in its place. I've grown to love the wing though, and visibility is actually very good, so unless someone has to have it and I could turn it around quickly I imagine its here to stay for a while at least. but I NEEED a lower lip to keep the front end planted.
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plus what would we have family picnics on during road trips?
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B3DAWG
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by B3DAWG » Wed Apr 18, 2018 5:29 am

EPiK wrote: Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:58 am I bought my very early 996.1 pretty modified by the POs.... 996 GT3 wheels, H&R sportsprings, replica of OEM aero front and skirts and GT3RS rep decklid and wing, K&N fipk intake and FabSpeed bypass tips. One thing I noticed right away is the need for a functional front lip to balance the downforce from the GT3RS rear. I totally get the reports of a light front end at 60+ mph.. kinda disconcerting when I want to head out and play on anything other than tight twisties, especially when the car accelerates and rocks back anyway.
IMHO, the Porsche 996 cars by design are so light on the nose that they can feel very scary at high speeds. When I start approaching 80 mph, I've noticed on both my p-cars, that the front lift gives the car a very unnerving loose feel in the steering and overall control of the car. Heavier sports "straight line" cars that are known to feel more planted and no have this problem, but would get schooled around the track. I think so many people think the base Carreras are top-speed 200 mph supercars that can hang with Ferrari LaFerrari, Bugatti Veyron, and others. hahahaha Nothing could be further from the truth. The beauty of these cars is when you're flying around curvy mountain roads or on the track. They're best known as quick and nimble sports car not something that would put a Veyron or Venom to shame on the 5-mile air strip.

"Ricers" on the other hand... that's another story. They tend to be the worse offenders at nippin' at the heels of a Porsche when identified on the open expressways. I'll never understand this crowd. Usually young, droopy pants, hat turned back millennials with no respect for their lives or others on the road.

I completely understand you wanting to make your 996 more aero dynamic on the front end of the car. Your car may just need some simple improvements like tweaking of the rear spoiler height and angle to improve rear down force. And, you may want to purchase a front lower lip spoiler and lower the car a bit to prevent air from creeping under the car especially at high speeds. Remember, you want high pressure to be hitting on the top of the car (not underneath) and low pressure on the rear to be exited without penaties on the back of the car.

Cheers!

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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by SealGrauWailer » Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:40 am

If the front feels loose & prone to diving, you might try some drop links to sturdy the sways. The chassis is certainly capable of precise handling up to the mid 100s, so tweak/tune until you get there imo.
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by gnat » Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:28 am

SealGrauWailer wrote: Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:40 am If the front feels loose & prone to diving, you might try some drop links to sturdy the sways. The chassis is certainly capable of precise handling up to the mid 100s, so tweak/tune until you get there imo.
The wing on the back changes everything though. Without the wing or with all the proper aero bits, yes these are incredibly stable cars at ludicrous speeds. An improperly balanced aero setup, however, can screw things up royally.

Edit: Ahh. Now I see you were probably replying to b3. Since he doesn't have aero bits yet, yeah I agree that his car shouldn't feel as described at 80. Drop links? Sway bars? Suspension? Bumpers and ducting installed correctly?

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Re: When your Aero goes Air-O!!!

Post by B3DAWG » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:46 am

gnat wrote: Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:28 am An improperly balanced aero setup, however, can screw things up royally.
All of these guys would agree 110% with you Gnat.
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Re: Flying Ducktail...

Post by FRUNKenstein » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:49 am

Looks to me like it is mainly a speed yellow issue, though.
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