So I was told about this site.....

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Dr_Strangelove
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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by Dr_Strangelove » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:57 pm

32wildbilly wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:44 am
Have no experience with the turbros and I realize DR researched it, but is that amount of smoke really normal for a hot start? Did the smoke smell like fuel or was it just cat moisture burn off?? Second thing: is it just the recording or does the engine have a pronounced clatter sound? If it was an NA I would think piston slap. Maybe just the phone sensitivity.
Anything I write here should be taken with a grain of salt because I am by no means any sort of authority on Turbos. I just looked it up on that other damn place to see if it was a common issue and it was, most people said ignore it.

I put my phone up really close to get the best recording of that "clatter", in hindsight I should have put the phone under the car but chalk that up to this being my first Outfax and the service will improve over time :lol:

The smoke didn't have a heavy odor to it and I think it would be irresponsible at this point to try and go back to memory lane and guess what it smelled like. It wasn't fuel, that's for sure.
2003 Carrera: Dark Teal Metallic

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32wildbilly
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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by 32wildbilly » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:11 pm

Dr_Strangelove wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:57 pm
32wildbilly wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:44 am
Have no experience with the turbros and I realize DR researched it, but is that amount of smoke really normal for a hot start? Did the smoke smell like fuel or was it just cat moisture burn off?? Second thing: is it just the recording or does the engine have a pronounced clatter sound? If it was an NA I would think piston slap. Maybe just the phone sensitivity.
Anything I write here should be taken with a grain of salt because I am by no means any sort of authority on Turbos. I just looked it up on that other damn place to see if it was a common issue and it was, most people said ignore it.

I put my phone up really close to get the best recording of that "clatter", in hindsight I should have put the phone under the car but chalk that up to this being my first Outfax and the service will improve over time :lol:

The smoke didn't have a heavy odor to it and I think it would be irresponsible at this point to try and go back to memory lane and guess what it smelled like. It wasn't fuel, that's for sure.
I believe you did a good Outfax. The pics and recording were nicely done. I was just wondering about those things. I've never even seen a 996 turbro up close! Hell...the first Rennfax(dammit) I did the car didn't even exist, at least in this town!! Come to think of it that was an alleged turbro, as well! :shock:

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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by FRUNKenstein » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:25 pm

32wildbilly wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:11 pm
I've never even seen a 996 turbro up close!
I know a quick and easy way to rectify that.
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Current:
2002 996TT X50, Guards Red
1987 928S4 Guards Red
1987 951 Guards Red

2006 955S Arctic Silver
2006 955S Lapis Blue
Gone but not forgotten: 1999 996 C4 Aerokit Black; 1990 964 C2 Guards Red

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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by ipman » Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:58 pm

I have mulled this over and I am going to pass. 2 reasons, 1) the sunroof scares me, that could be as big as removing the headliner and replacing the assembly, I rather not do that and 2) I do not know for certain, but I suspect they would charge me sales tax. I am not going to pay 8.1% in NV and 8.25% in TX (ouch), I would be better off just getting an in state one. I will focus on a private party in/out of state (ideally) or a dealer in state. I am patient and came wait until the right one comes along.

Thanks again Doc. Keep me posted if you see something pop up.

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Dr_Strangelove
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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by Dr_Strangelove » Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:23 am

No problem, it was fun.

Some info for your search onward: I have bought a few cars out of state and have only paid NV sales tax. In one case I got a Nevada moving permit, the other was on a trailer. My understanding from out of state dealers is you're not allowed to drive the car in the state you're not paying taxes in, after you buy it. They'll get you at your home DMV.

The sunroof was a bleep of a bleep.
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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by b3freak » Mon Jul 02, 2018 6:00 am

ipman wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:58 pm
I have mulled this over and I am going to pass. 2 reasons, 1) the sunroof scares me, that could be as big as removing the headliner and replacing the assembly, I rather not do that and 2) I do not know for certain, but I suspect they would charge me sales tax. I am not going to pay 8.1% in NV and 8.25% in TX (ouch), I would be better off just getting an in state one. I will focus on a private party in/out of state (ideally) or a dealer in state. I am patient and came wait until the right one comes along.

Thanks again Doc. Keep me posted if you see something pop up.
I think the car is pretty good deal for a manual Porsche turbo if the PPI checked out ok. It would be nice if they'd knock a little more off the price based on the over condition that Doc showed on the video. If you paid for a PPI, you could always try using the findings as bargaining chips.

RE: sales tax... You pay taxes in Texas not NV and, you DON'T pay sale taxes twice. However, the state of Texas may have a tax reciprocal agreement with Nevada. This mean you pay a portion of the sales tax at the point of sale and the remainder when you register it at your local tag office. The tax value is based on DMV market value, not the exact price you paid for the vehicle. This tax value is hopefully lower than the price you paid. If it's higher, you can appeal it by making copies of the dealer's bill of sale. Here is your tax calculator:

http://www.txdmv.gov/spv-calculator

Fortunately, your tax office is only valuing the car at $23,000 and so you'd owe about $1433 on taxes in Texas.

Always good to double check with your local tag office.
2002 Porsche 996 Carrera - bare bones basic, but still a blast to drive! Heck, I don't even have PSM on it. Ha!

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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by ipman » Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:51 pm

Still thinking about the Vegas one. They priced it out for me and I would only pay TX taxes, so that is good.

But then.... I saw this beauty tonight. Opinions please. This car appears to be in much better condition and has records, I emailed them for details. The better half liked this one much more. And it is in Tejas, so major bonus.

https://www.xsellmotors.com/vehicle-det ... d-24652281

Some more questions
1- i read that the 2nd gear syncro is not an issue for 03+, is this true?
2- where can I find out changes by model year? Like, what does an 03 have than an 01 does not.
3- Pinned is good, is this an engine out task if it is not?

Thanks for letting me bounce these off ya'll. I know cars, but not Porsche's so much.

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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by b3freak » Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:59 am

ipman wrote:
Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:51 pm
Still thinking about the Vegas one. They priced it out for me and I would only pay TX taxes, so that is good.

But then.... I saw this beauty tonight. Opinions please. This car appears to be in much better condition and has records, I emailed them for details. The better half liked this one much more. And it is in Tejas, so major bonus.

https://www.xsellmotors.com/vehicle-det ... d-24652281

Some more questions
1- i read that the 2nd gear syncro is not an issue for 03+, is this true?
2- where can I find out changes by model year? Like, what does an 03 have than an 01 does not.
3- Pinned is good, is this an engine out task if it is not?

Thanks for letting me bounce these off ya'll. I know cars, but not Porsche's so much.
These are *apples and oranges* Porsches Turbo which explains the price of almost $10,000 difference. Obviously, the Guards Red is superior to the Arctic Silver Turbo in condition. It doesn't take long looking at the pictures to know that the red Turbo was babied and taken care of where as the silver Turbo at the BMW dealership looks like it was "rode hard and put up wet"! The only thing that might be malfunctioning is the rear spoiler. Which is shown parked in up position. The hydraulics on the turbo spoiler are known to fail. But that wouldn't be a deal breaker, IMHO. I don't think there were any radical changes on the Turbos between '01 and '03 with the exception of the X50 option which both of the cars don't have. There are some noticeable interior changes. The '03 Turbo has the newer digital "MOST" CDR-23 BOSE system and the '01 has the older CR-220 analog BOSE system. Some people would think the newer digital system is superior, but in my opinion, the older analog systems are better and more reliable. It's obviously, the '03 has some nice detail upgrades like the painted center console to match the exterior color and the silver trimmed shifter and gauge cluster. But these things are just curls on a pig's tail... that is, doesn't add any more pork to the pig!

You have to ask yourself, is it worth it to go $10,000 more dollars for a nicer Turbo? I don't know.. that's your call. For me, I'm cheap, I couldn't even think about spending Turbo money. But to each his own! Enjoy and good luck!
2002 Porsche 996 Carrera - bare bones basic, but still a blast to drive! Heck, I don't even have PSM on it. Ha!

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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by DTMiller » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:19 am

If the red one is in your comfort zone price wise then either is fine because they will both end up costing you the same total. Red obv faster color.
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Re: So I was told about this site.....

Post by FRUNKenstein » Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:59 am

DT's absolutely correct in that the red one will be much faster - kinda goes without saying.

As for your questions:
1. The 2nd gear popout issue is WAAY overblown. Yes, on 2003 and newer cars, you don't have to worry about it. But, if a 2001 or 2002 had it, it would likely have been fixed by now. And, most often it can be fixed with an inexpensive repair. Yes, it is possible to still see one in the wild with the 2nd gear popout issue and it is possible that it could require replacing synchros to fix. But, I'll bet you'd have to look at 100 cars to find one with that problem.
2. Changes 2001 to 2003: as B3 states, 2003 and newer will have the MOST system for the stereo - not necessarily a good thing (harder to modify if you want to upgrade to a newer, better system than a 15 year old one); you will get a glovebox on 2002 and newer cars, and slightly (very slightly) nicer interior. Starting in 2002, you could get the X50 power kit on a car, but, again, as B3 states, neither of these has the X50. Plus, it is very easy to tune a non-X50 car to produce more power than an X50 car, which is more power than you'll ever need. The 2005 only "Turbo S" is really just a 2003-4 model with both the X50 power kit and the PCCB brakes. They normally bring a big premium, just because they are rare - not because they are better. That's about it. Frankly, there simply isn't much of a difference between a 2001 and a 2005 Turbo S. With the same miles and condition, though a 2001 will be cheaper than a 2002-2004 model which will be cheaper than a 2005 Turbo S. I would not hesitate to buy any model year of 996tt - just make sure you pay a market appropriate price.
3. Coolant Pipes Pinning - It can be done with the engine in the car, but almost everyone has it done with the engine out. Why? Well it is easier, but more importantly, it is considered one of the things that can wait until you have another service that requires dropping the engine. If you don't track the car, then don't even worry about doing it. If you plan to track the car, then you'll want to have it done, but it isn't like an IMS bearing where the price of failure is a blown engine. If your coolant pipes come unglued, then you'll lose coolant. If it happens on a track, that will end your weekend and can be a hazard for the other racers, so guys who track their cars get them pinned. If it happens on the street, you pull over and have the car flatbedded to your nearest shop to have them done, but it is very, very, very rare that it ever happens on the street. If you have 2 identical cars, and one is pinned and the other isn't, then I would consider it a factor. Oh, and by the way, now, the standard for this repair is to have the coolant pipes "welded" into place rather than just pinned as the pinned pipes can still leak. So, pinned is better than unpinned, but the hardcore guys are going to tell you that you still need to have them welded.

One last thing is that you are likely to never "lose" a dime on either of these cars. If you pay an appropriate price for a 996tt, then at this point on their depreciation/appreciation curve, you are going to get your money back come selling time (assuming you've kept the car in good condition). So, the cost involved is maintenance, which you'll have with any car. Over the past nearly 3 years since I've had my 996TT, it has been the cheapest car to maintain in my garage. So, in choosing between a higher-mileage car with questions re: maintenance and a lower-mileage car with known good maintenance, it is probably cheaper in the long run to buy the more expensive car.
www.kansascityautomuseum.com
Current:
2002 996TT X50, Guards Red
1987 928S4 Guards Red
1987 951 Guards Red

2006 955S Arctic Silver
2006 955S Lapis Blue
Gone but not forgotten: 1999 996 C4 Aerokit Black; 1990 964 C2 Guards Red

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